March 17, 2025

UnLearning Parenting: The Hard Truths of Blended Families

UnLearning Parenting: The Hard Truths of Blended Families
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Eric Ballentine, Executive Director of Streets Ministries in Memphis, shares his journey through fatherhood, marriage, and ministry as someone who "jumped off the porch" at age 12 before finding his faith at 25. His powerful story reveals how his past experiences shaped his approach to raising children in a blended family and the lessons he learned about authentic manhood along the way.

• Born and raised in South Memphis, youngest of seven siblings with an extended family that includes 21 grandchildren and 23 great-grandchildren
• Developed a blended family when he married at 25, with his wife bringing a biological daughter and Eric having a son from a previous relationship
• Had to unlearn toxic masculinity and what he thought was "authentic manhood" after accepting Christ
• Found himself becoming "super dad" to many youth in ministry while potentially missing quality time with his own children
• Realized he was projecting his own childhood trauma onto his blended family dynamic, watching closely how his wife treated his biological son
• Experienced reconciliation with his oldest son after a period of estrangement, learning that sometimes being right doesn't matter if you lose the relationship
• Offers practical advice for navigating blended families including not forcing relationships and preventing children from speaking negatively about their other parent


Chapters

00:00 - Meeting Eric Ballantyne

04:27 - Growing Up in South Memphis

09:48 - Early Relationships and Blended Family

18:03 - Unlearning Toxic Masculinity

26:02 - Balancing Ministry and Fatherhood

33:11 - Father-Son Relationship Challenges

43:26 - Advice for Blended Families

57:22 - Closing Thoughts

Transcript
WEBVTT

00:00:06.450 --> 00:00:09.896
Hello everyone and welcome to the Unlearned Podcast.

00:00:09.896 --> 00:00:26.393
I'm your host, ruth Abigail Smith, and you have stumbled upon a podcast that is here to help you gain the courage to change your mind, and today we have the privilege of speaking with genuinely one of my favorite people.

00:00:26.393 --> 00:00:34.167
I don't call everybody this, but this man truly is my big brother and I'm so grateful for him.

00:00:34.167 --> 00:00:39.292
If you are listening from Memphis, you probably know who he is.

00:00:39.292 --> 00:00:41.027
You certainly know where he works.

00:00:41.027 --> 00:00:50.334
He is the executive director of Streets Ministries and he has been doing ministry in Memphis for quite some time, born and raised.

00:00:50.334 --> 00:00:58.351
He's going to tell you all that himself and talk a little bit about who he is, but this man's name is Eric Ballantyne.

00:00:58.351 --> 00:01:01.685
Mr Ballantyne, welcome to the Unlearned Podcast.

00:01:02.207 --> 00:01:03.972
Ruth Abigail, how are you today?

00:01:04.200 --> 00:01:07.421
I'm great man it's good to be with you Likewise.

00:01:07.421 --> 00:01:09.084
Yeah, this is exciting.

00:01:09.105 --> 00:01:10.567
This is truly my sister.

00:01:10.647 --> 00:01:14.021
I mean truly, we siblings for real.

00:01:14.481 --> 00:01:15.022
For real.

00:01:15.183 --> 00:01:18.329
I mean we behave like siblings, Absolutely.

00:01:18.329 --> 00:01:21.783
So just be warned, Be forewarned.

00:01:21.783 --> 00:01:24.088
We didn't prepare too much for this Right.

00:01:24.088 --> 00:01:29.762
We didn't want to, so this is going to be a great conversation.

00:01:29.762 --> 00:01:51.647
I'm particularly excited about this conversation because, Eric, you're an executive director of a long-lasting that's not the word I'm looking for a very prominent nonprofit in the city, and so you speak all the time.

00:01:51.647 --> 00:01:58.153
I mean, you speak about ministry and you speak about young people and you do that right.

00:01:58.153 --> 00:02:02.602
So if you're in Memphis and local, you've probably heard him or you've heard something he said.

00:02:02.602 --> 00:02:06.811
He's done music, so his voice is not unknown to the city.

00:02:06.811 --> 00:02:10.346
But what I'm excited about today is we're going to dig into some stuff he doesn't normally talk about.

00:02:11.109 --> 00:02:11.349
Right.

00:02:11.752 --> 00:02:25.376
We're going to dig we're going to dig, and I'm excited because we get to talk to Eric the man, not Eric the director, right, and I like that.

00:02:25.376 --> 00:02:30.127
And so I want us to just start with.

00:02:30.127 --> 00:02:43.568
I'd love just for you to introduce yourself to the people, tell them what it is that's interesting about you, where you grew up, a little bit of your story, how in the world you got to this place, and then we'll just dig a little bit.

00:02:43.908 --> 00:02:44.570
All right, Thanks again.

00:02:44.570 --> 00:02:47.838
Story how in the world you got to this place, and then we'll just dig a little bit.

00:02:47.838 --> 00:02:48.340
All right, Thanks again.

00:02:48.340 --> 00:02:57.015
So honored to be here on the Unlearned podcast tonight and just to share a little bit of who I am and hopefully we can glean from each other tonight.

00:02:57.015 --> 00:03:00.870
I'm from Memphis, a native Memphian born and raised here.

00:03:00.870 --> 00:03:05.477
As of a week or so ago, I've been here 46 years.

00:03:05.497 --> 00:03:06.139
Come on 46.

00:03:06.219 --> 00:03:11.109
So that's my entire life right and I love Memphis.

00:03:11.109 --> 00:03:16.191
Born and raised in the south part of Memphis, affectionately known as South.

00:03:16.191 --> 00:03:22.305
Memphis South Memphis sure, and youngest of seven, youngest of seven.

00:03:22.305 --> 00:03:25.747
My mom, beautiful mom, now is 76.

00:03:25.747 --> 00:03:28.132
And her baby boy is 46.

00:03:28.132 --> 00:03:37.600
It's weird, so weird, but she's beautiful as ever, healthy, doing fine, and all of my siblings are still here in town.

00:03:37.760 --> 00:03:38.080
Wow.

00:03:39.002 --> 00:03:40.824
And just give you the roots of that.

00:03:40.824 --> 00:03:47.191
My mama has seven children, 21 grandchildren and 23 great-grands.

00:03:47.231 --> 00:03:48.072
And they're all here.

00:03:48.072 --> 00:03:50.754
No, they're everywhere oh they're everywhere, okay, okay, all over the world.

00:03:50.794 --> 00:03:52.016
Wow Ireland somewhere.

00:03:52.016 --> 00:04:03.846
But no yeah, but, yeah, the grands and the great-grands a nice portion of them are here, Wow, but they're like scattered all over the United States, but all of my siblings are here in the city.

00:04:03.846 --> 00:04:09.959
So, yeah, been married to my lovely wife, barbara now for 20 years.

00:04:09.959 --> 00:04:20.547
Yes, 20 years of marriage going on 40, right, and 20 years of being happily married and we have three children.

00:04:20.547 --> 00:04:22.509
So, yeah, okay, yeah, cool man, that's me in a nutshell.

00:04:22.529 --> 00:04:24.471
I love it, I love it, I love it, I yeah, okay, yeah, cool man.

00:04:24.552 --> 00:04:25.353
That's me in a nutshell.

00:04:25.473 --> 00:04:27.576
I love it, I love it, I love it, I love it.

00:04:27.576 --> 00:04:30.108
So all right.

00:04:30.108 --> 00:04:34.351
So you're married, have three children.

00:04:34.351 --> 00:04:36.766
How old were you when you got married?

00:04:36.766 --> 00:04:38.384
Well, you said 20 years.

00:04:38.384 --> 00:04:39.067
I was 20.

00:04:39.067 --> 00:04:39.750
I should do math.

00:04:40.040 --> 00:04:41.822
Yeah, I was 25 when.

00:04:41.843 --> 00:04:47.533
I got married, 25 when you got married, 25 when you got married, and so so I'm going on 21.

00:04:47.894 --> 00:04:50.846
So, of course, Right, okay, yeah, 21 years, okay.

00:04:50.846 --> 00:05:09.175
So yeah, because this is kind of leading us into where we want to go right, it's just kind of learning a little bit about who you are, who you have been as a husband, as a father, as a man out here in these Memphis streets doing your life, right.

00:05:09.175 --> 00:05:17.927
So tell us, just tell us, a little bit of that experience, right, kind of start where you want to start with that.

00:05:17.927 --> 00:05:18.769
Tell us a little bit.

00:05:19.000 --> 00:05:22.348
Okay, I guess more about my upbringing, about your upbringing.

00:05:22.348 --> 00:05:23.632
Or marriage more so.

00:05:23.879 --> 00:05:26.785
Yeah about your upbringing, about my upbringing, about your upbringing About marriage.

00:05:26.785 --> 00:05:29.149
More so, yeah about your upbringing.

00:05:29.149 --> 00:05:34.538
So share with us a little bit about who Eric was as a young man, husband, father.

00:05:35.980 --> 00:05:36.742
Okay, got you.

00:05:36.742 --> 00:05:36.982
Okay.

00:05:36.982 --> 00:05:46.064
Well, for me I mentioned at the age of 25 is when I got married, and for some people they're like that's young, that's's young, that's so young.

00:05:46.064 --> 00:06:02.081
But I felt old at 25 because I literally jumped off the porch pretty early, when I was about 12-ish or 13,.

00:06:02.081 --> 00:06:08.293
I started doing big boy things and got involved in a lot of the streets, gangs, drugs, stuff like that.

00:06:08.439 --> 00:06:13.016
So by the time I was 16, you know, I thought I was grown.

00:06:13.016 --> 00:06:13.680
You know what I'm saying.

00:06:13.680 --> 00:06:27.670
So at 25, I was OG to me, you know, and to some others, you know, like man, you know, he'd been there, done that already, and so I was ready to settle down by that time.

00:06:27.670 --> 00:06:46.569
Her and I had been dating for at that time, right at three years, and she entered into the relationship with a biological daughter Okay, at that time was four years old, okay, and I had a biological son, okay, who was three months.

00:06:46.569 --> 00:06:56.848
Oh, wow, yeah, wow, when we, you know, like real talk, when we met and I was living fast, yeah, and then we had a son together, yeah, yeah.

00:06:56.869 --> 00:06:59.192
Wow, right Okay.

00:06:59.192 --> 00:07:02.122
Yeah, all right, so let's talk about that.

00:07:02.122 --> 00:07:07.351
So both of you had children going into the marriage.

00:07:07.351 --> 00:07:09.134
Going into the marriage or the relationship?

00:07:09.379 --> 00:07:11.447
Well, coming into the relationship, Coming into the relationship.

00:07:11.528 --> 00:07:17.353
Okay, so you both had children coming into the relationship and then you had a child together.

00:07:17.353 --> 00:07:25.074
So talk about a little bit that experience navigating, blending a family.

00:07:25.841 --> 00:07:26.685
I had no idea.

00:07:26.685 --> 00:07:28.930
She had no idea.

00:07:28.930 --> 00:07:35.620
Yeah, we just you know we were in love, right, yeah, and all we know is you know we love each other.

00:07:35.620 --> 00:07:42.834
And I really didn't know anything about being a father, being a parent.

00:07:42.834 --> 00:07:47.750
I grew up pretty much in a single-parent home.

00:07:47.750 --> 00:07:58.831
Youngest of seven, my mom thought it would be better for me to live with my grandparents, so I was technically raised primarily by my grandmother.

00:07:58.831 --> 00:08:04.413
My grandfather died in a car accident when I was six, so I stayed with my grandmother.

00:08:04.413 --> 00:08:09.651
So I was slick the only child for a second there.

00:08:09.651 --> 00:08:13.139
I could put my Kool-Aid in the refrigerator and nobody drink it right, Sure, sure.

00:08:13.521 --> 00:08:23.389
But I was the only kid for a minute, and then my grandmother was just very kind, loving, so she adopted another family.

00:08:23.709 --> 00:08:23.930
Wow.

00:08:24.079 --> 00:08:37.320
There was another family in the community and this lady was very ill, like stage four cancer, and her children had been in the system.

00:08:37.320 --> 00:08:42.626
Some and her and my grandma had become friends and she was like, hey, I'm dying, become friends.

00:08:42.626 --> 00:08:48.335
And she was like, hey, you know I'm dying and but I want my kids to stay together.

00:08:48.595 --> 00:08:48.796
Wow.

00:08:54.660 --> 00:08:55.965
You know, will you promise me that you'll keep my family?

00:08:55.965 --> 00:09:00.154
My grandma said yes, so she took her four kids into our house and they became my siblings.

00:09:00.154 --> 00:09:05.765
Wow, so my family was blended all around, you know, and?

00:09:05.765 --> 00:09:11.052
And the lady was white and the kid's father was African-American.

00:09:11.072 --> 00:09:12.293
Okay.

00:09:12.394 --> 00:09:17.754
So yeah, wait a minute, all right so all right, so there's a lot going on.

00:09:17.754 --> 00:09:18.659
Right, yeah, right.

00:09:19.802 --> 00:09:22.308
So how old were you when they moved in?

00:09:23.331 --> 00:09:27.128
I'm not mistaken, I had to be around 10.

00:09:27.649 --> 00:09:27.870
Okay.

00:09:28.480 --> 00:09:30.948
I would say around 9 or 10.

00:09:30.948 --> 00:09:35.942
Okay, and they were much older than me, you know well.

00:09:35.942 --> 00:09:39.155
Yeah, back then it seemed like they were grown, they were like 16.

00:09:39.437 --> 00:09:40.100
Oh, they were really.

00:09:40.120 --> 00:09:42.269
Yeah, 16, 15, 16.

00:09:42.269 --> 00:09:43.163
Okay, One was maybe 20.

00:09:43.163 --> 00:09:43.384
Oh, 16.

00:09:43.384 --> 00:09:44.774
One was maybe 20.

00:09:44.774 --> 00:09:45.599
Oh, wow.

00:09:46.381 --> 00:09:50.572
And they were very well known in the community.

00:09:50.572 --> 00:10:01.673
One of them, particularly the one that I wanted to be just like Chris, was like man.

00:10:01.673 --> 00:10:06.442
He was that winsome guy was like man, he was that winsome guy.

00:10:06.442 --> 00:10:10.404
What's funny is in the hood you're super light-skinned, with good hair.

00:10:10.404 --> 00:10:11.385
You're a nickname, white boy.

00:10:11.385 --> 00:10:14.368
So Chris was white boy and everybody loved Chris.

00:10:14.368 --> 00:10:15.109
Everybody loved white boy.

00:10:15.129 --> 00:10:16.129
White boy, chris, that's his name.

00:10:16.129 --> 00:10:24.394
Everybody knew him as that and he was just one of those guys who was charismatic, loving, funny.

00:10:24.394 --> 00:10:27.057
But he was feared.

00:10:27.057 --> 00:10:35.201
He was like man.

00:10:35.201 --> 00:10:42.942
He just had this anger and this rage from his experiences as a child and even trying to process the death of his mom and the fact that his dad was not in his life and that he had to go through this system.

00:10:42.942 --> 00:10:52.436
You know all of the porter leaves, the tall trees, secs, dogwoods, any system you can think of, fostering, whatever.

00:10:52.436 --> 00:11:02.529
He went through a lot of that and he had a lot of rage and bitterness, but he was the one that I loved the most and I kind of wanted to be like him.

00:11:02.529 --> 00:11:07.631
So when I jumped off that porch, I jumped off the porch with intentions of becoming him.

00:11:07.631 --> 00:11:10.485
You know, just being honest.

00:11:10.686 --> 00:11:11.649
Yeah, no, that's good.

00:11:11.649 --> 00:11:26.128
So your experience is really you've got a blended experience from a lot of different angles.

00:11:26.168 --> 00:11:27.010
Right, right.

00:11:29.763 --> 00:11:30.524
And all right.

00:11:30.524 --> 00:11:39.052
So I want to talk a little bit more about jumping off the porch, because I think that that is a well, that's key to your story, right, right.

00:11:39.052 --> 00:11:51.255
And I love how you kind of said in the beginning 25 for you was like- Retired Right, you were retired right yeah.

00:11:51.255 --> 00:11:56.846
So tell me if I'm wrong.

00:11:56.846 --> 00:12:08.590
Like your perspective on life may have been a little bit more, would you call it more mature than most 25-year-olds because of your experience, or is that accurate?

00:12:08.779 --> 00:12:09.825
Yeah, I think that's accurate.

00:12:09.825 --> 00:13:05.075
Okay, again, by 25, I had done more than most and I thought what's weird is, at 25, for me, all of the things I had been involved in and had experienced, I thought I was this guy, I thought this was my identity, what I saw in my brother Right, I wanted to be that and I thought that was authentic manhood, I guess I can say, and it was not until I accepted Christ at 25 and started surrounding myself around some men who were imitating Christ that I really found out that, hey, I have no idea what I'm doing here and I had to kind of relearn, unlearn what I thought was authentic manhood and then learn what true manhood would.

00:13:05.075 --> 00:13:20.587
At the same time, while I'm trying to figure out this parenting thing and being a husband right, wow, right, because all I had was my experiences, what I've seen, and my dad I lost him in 2014.

00:13:20.587 --> 00:13:34.328
Great man, we had a great relationship, but early on and I'm an open book, so the way I was conceived was out of wedlock, you know, my dad was married and stepped out.

00:13:34.328 --> 00:13:35.909
Yeah, and here I am right.

00:13:35.929 --> 00:13:38.408
Yeah, and as a kid, you don't know that.

00:13:38.408 --> 00:13:41.710
As a kid, all you know is, hey, that's dad, that's mom Right.

00:13:41.710 --> 00:13:44.671
Why can't I go to that house, right, right, that's dad, that's mom Right.

00:13:44.671 --> 00:13:46.820
Why can't I go to that house, right, right.

00:13:46.820 --> 00:14:28.774
So some of those childhood experiences, you know, when I started to mature and go through my adolescence or whatever, some of those things were brought to my attention, right, like, oh, this happened, oh, that's why I couldn't go here, oh, that's why that lady looked at me like that, and so all that bitterness that I told you my brother, had I had my adopted brother, had I began to have that bitterness toward my biological father, yeah, even toward my grandmother who raised me, why you didn't tell me, you know just so many other things that just created somewhat of a monster.

00:14:28.774 --> 00:14:33.506
I guess I can say, yeah, because what you would do is you'd take it out on anybody.

00:14:33.506 --> 00:14:35.952
You can right your frustration, so yeah.

00:14:36.879 --> 00:14:52.654
So you well, here's the thing, right, you were challenged to emulate something that you hadn't been practicing.

00:14:52.654 --> 00:15:16.066
Pretty quickly, right, right, and you had to work through all of this stuff to get to this point to you know, to, to, to function as a man, right, and the, the way that you had learned, like you said, manhood was different than how you had been introduced to it in your old age of 25.

00:15:16.125 --> 00:15:16.486
Right.

00:15:16.988 --> 00:15:24.083
Um and so how, how did that that unlearning manhood process look?

00:15:24.083 --> 00:15:24.485
What?

00:15:24.485 --> 00:15:27.630
What were some examples of what that looked like?

00:15:28.393 --> 00:15:43.174
Oh, man, one thing was learning how to control your emotions, learning conflict resolution, you know, because you used to handle this stuff this way Right, this way Right.

00:15:43.174 --> 00:15:51.413
But when you started to really learn about true, authentic man, biblical man, who's a, you know, real man?

00:15:51.413 --> 00:15:52.053
Fight on the knees.

00:15:52.053 --> 00:16:01.869
You know, we don't take it to our, you know, to the fist, but for me I had to kind of get over the anger stuff, work some stuff out with myself.

00:16:01.869 --> 00:16:08.162
But, mind you, I'm trying to do all of this.

00:16:08.182 --> 00:16:26.836
So all of my old ways of getting money, my old ways of handling my disputes, yep, all ways of everything, how I navigated right, matriculated through the era of my life in that I'm still trying to figure out how to be a parent, and that was the piece for me.

00:16:26.836 --> 00:16:30.129
So I probably made a ton of mistakes.

00:16:30.129 --> 00:16:34.847
I did the best I could, but I started to model myself.

00:16:34.847 --> 00:16:40.732
But the transition for me was watching again, men of God that I looked up to.

00:16:40.732 --> 00:16:52.139
I watched how they handled their wives, how they treated them with class and respect, how they nurtured their kids, their relationship.

00:16:52.139 --> 00:16:55.899
I kind of watched how they disciplined their children.

00:16:55.918 --> 00:16:56.000
Yeah.

00:16:57.280 --> 00:17:05.442
Because I didn't want to again my childhood experiences to totally influence how I handled my children.

00:17:05.442 --> 00:17:09.801
If that makes sense, correct, there were some great elements of it, I think.

00:17:09.801 --> 00:17:14.469
One thing I can say I hope I'm not getting ahead here but one thing with my dad.

00:17:14.469 --> 00:17:19.542
Again, he was not there in the house with me, but I think about it.

00:17:19.542 --> 00:17:21.710
I saw him two days a week.

00:17:21.710 --> 00:17:24.748
He bought all my school stuff.

00:17:24.748 --> 00:17:26.766
He was very loving to me.

00:17:26.766 --> 00:17:31.609
I just couldn't go to his house and I got something to say about that later on when you're talking about bleeding the families.

00:17:31.609 --> 00:17:37.532
But I couldn't go to his house because his wife didn't accept me.

00:17:37.532 --> 00:17:41.150
She knew about me but she didn't accept me.

00:17:41.150 --> 00:17:46.108
And so he told me in his latter years we were talking.

00:17:46.108 --> 00:17:50.307
One day he said son, he said man, I made a lot of mistakes.

00:17:50.307 --> 00:17:58.028
He said, but one thing I didn't do, I didn't deny you, and I had to agree with him with that, because I mean all throughout my childhood I had a dad.

00:17:58.028 --> 00:17:59.244
I knew I had a dad.

00:17:59.244 --> 00:18:04.973
I didn't know the dad's supposed to be in the house, I just knew, hey, he'd take care of me, he'd come over here.

00:18:04.973 --> 00:18:10.290
He even disciplined me and that's something that I learned from him about discipline.

00:18:10.779 --> 00:18:13.546
People have different views on spanking your kid.

00:18:13.546 --> 00:18:15.750
Or do you put him in the corner time out, or whatever.

00:18:15.750 --> 00:18:19.645
I got spankings, but I didn't get beatings.

00:18:19.645 --> 00:18:21.660
I got spankings.

00:18:21.660 --> 00:18:31.548
My dad was a truck driver, so he's in and out of town or whatever and I'm just a boy, I'm trying to set the big wheel on fire.

00:18:31.548 --> 00:18:32.826
I'm just crazy.

00:18:32.826 --> 00:18:38.813
So my grandmother would tell my dad and I'm like, oh Lord, he coming.

00:18:38.940 --> 00:18:46.270
So when he would pull up in the truck, I'm like, oh, okay, but he would come in spend quality time with my grandmother.

00:18:46.270 --> 00:19:03.586
Then he would call me in, he would discuss the situation with me in front of my grandmother, calmly, never raise his voice, and I was super intimidated because it was my dad, but I wasn't afraid he's going to kill me right now.

00:19:03.586 --> 00:19:15.372
I knew I was in trouble, but even before he would spank me, he would sit down and explain to me why Wow, you can't do this, and that's something that I'll never forget.

00:19:15.372 --> 00:19:25.232
So I was like, okay, in this parenting thing, I know my kid's going to do some crazy stuff, yeah, and there may be some times where I may have to discipline them like that, but I want to do it like he did.

00:19:25.232 --> 00:19:28.584
You know what I mean, so that was a good takeaway.

00:19:28.584 --> 00:19:38.843
So that's one man that I watched and learned some things from, and then my pastor and other people that I had an opportunity to do.

00:19:39.204 --> 00:19:42.651
That's beautiful.

00:19:42.651 --> 00:19:48.971
That's a beautiful picture of fatherhood.

00:19:48.971 --> 00:20:01.313
You said something you know that you could never go to him Right, Right, Right to him.

00:20:01.794 --> 00:20:02.054
Right.

00:20:02.214 --> 00:20:02.895
Right, right.

00:20:02.895 --> 00:20:17.070
So so this and and so there was a, so I guess the a difference right of fatherhood being the fatherhood you experienced, of, like you said, two days a week versus seven days a week.

00:20:17.251 --> 00:20:18.513
Right In the home Right.

00:20:18.554 --> 00:20:29.288
Right there with you Are there some immediate differences that you saw as a father, that you realized was a different experience you had as a kid.

00:20:29.449 --> 00:20:30.442
Right, I guess, comically.

00:20:30.442 --> 00:20:32.388
First I'd say, get on your nerves.

00:20:32.388 --> 00:20:33.029
I see why.

00:20:33.029 --> 00:20:34.664
I see why you let me come to you.

00:20:34.664 --> 00:20:35.468
No, I'm just joking.

00:20:35.468 --> 00:20:45.411
But no, my kids had, all three of them had.

00:20:45.891 --> 00:20:52.137
That I longed for was being able to touch your father.

00:20:52.137 --> 00:20:53.680
You know what I'm saying.

00:20:53.680 --> 00:20:58.711
Yeah, I remember sitting there as a kid, like what's my daddy number?

00:20:58.711 --> 00:21:00.305
You know, call him.

00:21:00.305 --> 00:21:01.865
And nobody would ever call him.

00:21:01.865 --> 00:21:03.763
And you know, later on you're like man.

00:21:03.763 --> 00:21:10.190
I was traumatized by that because I wanted to talk to my daddy, I want to wrestle with my daddy, or whatever, right, because I couldn't do that with my grandfather anymore.

00:21:10.190 --> 00:21:18.099
He was gone and so I had no man that I could physically touch to get that appropriate affection from right.

00:21:18.099 --> 00:21:23.925
And so my children had that every night, every, you know, whenever I worked all the time.

00:21:23.925 --> 00:21:29.471
So when I get home, man, they jumping on your neck, your back, wrestling, tickling.

00:21:29.471 --> 00:21:40.865
It's just, and again that goes to with Barbara and I when we decided to become one again.

00:21:40.865 --> 00:21:48.384
She's bringing her biological daughter into picture and I have a biological son who does not live in the house, right?

00:21:48.565 --> 00:21:55.861
yeah so that's a blended family that we now have, and nobody has taught us how to manage that thing.

00:21:56.580 --> 00:22:02.405
So um can I ask you this sure, sure what, how was like?

00:22:02.405 --> 00:22:09.471
How, what kind of conversations did you and Barbara have?

00:22:09.471 --> 00:22:11.114
Or didn't have that?

00:22:11.114 --> 00:22:14.656
Maybe you look back and be like, hey, we should have talked about this Right, that's it.

00:22:14.656 --> 00:22:15.176
You know what I mean.

00:22:15.176 --> 00:22:21.799
Yeah, when it comes to handling parenting each other's children, Right.

00:22:22.080 --> 00:22:25.971
I think, man, we should have had the conversations.

00:22:25.971 --> 00:22:28.297
We did the best we could.

00:22:28.297 --> 00:22:30.686
Yeah, we both were loving people.

00:22:30.686 --> 00:22:40.515
I was not a tyrant in the house or never been a violent guy, abusive guy verbally, or none of that.

00:22:40.515 --> 00:22:42.186
No cursing around my kids, none of that stuff.

00:22:42.186 --> 00:22:45.361
So I wasn't that type of guy, none of that, you know.

00:22:45.361 --> 00:22:47.361
No cursing around my kids, none of that stuff.

00:22:47.361 --> 00:22:49.280
So I wasn't that type of guy.

00:22:49.280 --> 00:23:06.845
But I was probably more legalistic than anything, like when I first accepted Christ, man, you know, I was like not to do nothing, you know, and I wish I had been a bit more open to allowing them to make some mistakes.

00:23:06.845 --> 00:23:10.645
Wow, yeah, I hope I'm not getting ahead, but that's what I feel Like.

00:23:10.645 --> 00:23:25.868
I feel like I was trying so hard to protect them from becoming me that I may have stopped them from becoming them, if that makes sense, if that makes sense.

00:23:25.969 --> 00:23:28.189
We're going to let that sit for just a second.

00:23:28.189 --> 00:23:28.868
That's good.

00:23:28.868 --> 00:23:34.690
Yeah, you said you didn't want them to become you, right?

00:23:34.690 --> 00:23:40.672
So you may, in the process, have stopped them from becoming them, right, right, wow.

00:23:41.211 --> 00:23:44.771
You know, but doing it out of love and trying to protect them.

00:23:44.892 --> 00:23:45.192
Yeah.

00:23:45.913 --> 00:24:00.256
Like I felt like it was my responsibility, to which it is, you know, but I was so overbearing with protecting them, yeah, and I should have let them learn a little bit more by experience.

00:24:00.256 --> 00:24:02.336
Now you know I'm mature Now.

00:24:02.336 --> 00:24:04.016
My kids are grown and gone.

00:24:04.016 --> 00:24:11.417
Barbara and I empty nesters, have been empty nesters now for about one or four years and I look back and they're grown.

00:24:11.417 --> 00:24:13.577
I'm like man, I wish I had it.

00:24:13.577 --> 00:24:16.878
This different, that different you know what were.

00:24:16.898 --> 00:24:18.999
so you say, not becoming like you.

00:24:20.500 --> 00:24:21.582
So what were you afraid of that?

00:24:21.582 --> 00:24:29.368
I think the biggest thing off top, just coming from where I come from, I didn't want the streets to get them.

00:24:29.368 --> 00:24:45.926
Yeah, you know, I didn't want our daughter to be treated the way I may have treated young ladies in my ignorance, right, or how I've seen young ladies be treated, right.

00:24:45.926 --> 00:24:47.974
So I felt like I got to protect her.

00:24:47.974 --> 00:24:49.117
Yeah, no, you can't go here.

00:24:49.117 --> 00:24:50.201
You can't go there, you can't do this.

00:24:50.201 --> 00:24:52.538
You know, you can't listen to this, you can't do that.

00:24:52.538 --> 00:24:55.740
And again, that was just legalistic for real.

00:24:55.740 --> 00:25:07.565
But I tried the approach of explaining it too, but still, at the end of the day, it was zero understanding, like no, this is it Like, this, is it what I say goes?

00:25:07.585 --> 00:25:23.672
Yeah, and I think I would have been if I could go back.

00:25:23.672 --> 00:25:27.438
This is hindsight, it's 2020, but if I could go back, I would be more open to listening to why they want to do this or give them a bigger voice.

00:25:27.438 --> 00:25:30.623
So how has that impacted your relationships with them as adults?

00:25:31.023 --> 00:25:32.651
Right, wow.

00:25:32.651 --> 00:25:41.115
I think one thing my children always knew was that I love them and they knew that they could come to me and talk about it.

00:25:41.115 --> 00:25:41.817
That was a good thing.

00:25:41.817 --> 00:25:55.205
Me working in youth ministry was sweet, but at the same time it was deceptive, because me being the youth leader, youth pastor, I'm always doing the crazy, creative stuff with the youth.

00:25:55.205 --> 00:26:03.520
So I was like super dad to so many other kids, like everybody want to be around, miss, a Right man, let's go.

00:26:03.520 --> 00:26:06.018
So my house was the spot Wow.

00:26:06.018 --> 00:26:08.377
So we got all the youth want to come hang at my house.

00:26:08.377 --> 00:26:11.377
Parents trust us, know they're with us, they're safe.

00:26:11.377 --> 00:26:13.162
We're doing the lock-ins, we're doing the camps.

00:26:13.162 --> 00:26:18.027
We're doing the lock-ins, we're doing the camps, we're doing whatever campfires, we're just doing everything together.

00:26:18.027 --> 00:26:25.655
And my kids loved it because they got the super cool dad who all the kids want to be around, who make everybody smile.

00:26:27.090 --> 00:26:40.369
But I worked so much to provide for them and I'm volunteering, doing all of this stuff here at the church and I think I lost out on you know, like the love languages the quality time.

00:26:40.369 --> 00:26:42.959
I think I missed out on.

00:26:42.959 --> 00:26:50.170
They may not say this, but I think that I missed out on some real quality time with them because it was always so crowded.

00:26:50.170 --> 00:26:58.661
You know, either we're at church, some youth function and then me, being a Christian rapper at that time, traveling, doing that.

00:26:58.661 --> 00:27:05.022
I tried to always include my family but I was like they got me but everybody got me.

00:27:05.022 --> 00:27:17.076
So I would rethink how I did that and probably fall back a little bit and spend some more intentional time with them Instead of dragging them all around.

00:27:18.011 --> 00:27:25.536
You saying a lot and I this is really because I think a lot, of, a lot of men.

00:27:25.536 --> 00:27:30.198
So you went from because I think this is so important and I think the connection here is so important.

00:27:30.198 --> 00:27:47.938
You went from doing your thing in the streets to being a husband and a father, to adding on to that youth pastor, right, right, and not just a youth pastor, but a really really good one, right.

00:27:48.419 --> 00:27:52.257
I hope I'm saying that I hope, yeah, just knowing who you are.

00:27:52.257 --> 00:27:55.940
But, like you said, super dad to all the kids right.

00:27:55.940 --> 00:28:04.824
Yeah, but even in that it's like if somebody looked at your kind of we'll call it manhood resume.

00:28:04.844 --> 00:28:05.023
Yeah.

00:28:05.309 --> 00:28:26.858
It's like man he is killing right there may have lacked the attention with your you know the children that you're stewarding because of the kind of energy put in.

00:28:26.858 --> 00:28:32.756
Being exactly who it is that you felt God called you to be Right, so that tension is real.

00:28:32.836 --> 00:28:33.679
Yeah, absolutely.

00:28:33.679 --> 00:28:35.273
Again.

00:28:35.273 --> 00:28:43.522
My wife and my kids probably would say something different, but it's my inner convictions, I know, and I'm like man.

00:28:43.522 --> 00:28:53.896
I think I missed it in some areas where I could have been a bit more intentional with getting to know each of them individually.

00:28:53.896 --> 00:28:57.605
It was more like this is what we do.

00:28:57.605 --> 00:28:58.830
Yeah, we.

00:28:58.830 --> 00:28:59.693
You know what I'm saying.

00:28:59.713 --> 00:29:07.029
Yes, this is what we do, yeah, but maybe she didn't, that wasn't her love language, or her, or that wasn't his love language.

00:29:07.029 --> 00:29:17.424
You know, like this kid and I would advise any parent out there, especially if you have a blended family get to know your children's love languages.

00:29:17.424 --> 00:29:22.301
Like one kid, it may be quality time, yeah.

00:29:22.301 --> 00:29:29.974
The other kid, it may be physical touch, and I use it in my real life, like my son that was in the house.

00:29:29.974 --> 00:29:33.903
He had dad 24-7 around the clock.

00:29:33.982 --> 00:29:34.163
Yep.

00:29:34.869 --> 00:29:38.641
And so I mean we roustled and the the crazy stuff, but he didn't touch me as much.

00:29:38.641 --> 00:29:46.000
But my oldest son, when he would come over on weekends, he couldn't keep his hands off me.

00:29:46.000 --> 00:29:49.896
Wow, I don't care what he said, dad, you know, hit me on the shoulder.

00:29:49.896 --> 00:30:02.138
He always just, and I didn't recognize that at first and as I started maturing and growing I was like dang, that was me wanting that as a kid with my dad.

00:30:02.138 --> 00:30:04.200
Wow, he needed that.

00:30:04.200 --> 00:30:05.781
Right, you know what I'm saying.

00:30:05.781 --> 00:30:09.163
And he didn't have me all the time.

00:30:09.163 --> 00:30:11.945
Yeah, so when he did, he going to take advantage of it.

00:30:11.945 --> 00:30:12.547
He going to take advantage.

00:30:12.547 --> 00:30:15.001
Just test me to death, you know what I'm saying.

00:30:15.041 --> 00:30:17.334
So can you, can you kind of talk a little bit about?

00:30:17.334 --> 00:30:20.239
Um, the difference in parenting?

00:30:20.339 --> 00:30:39.349
yeah a child in the home and one who lives away from home that's a tricky one because, uh, a lot of variables, like it depends on the relationship between you, uh, and the other parent, because when you're co-parenting, sometimes that can be smooth and sometimes it can be challenging Absolutely.

00:30:39.349 --> 00:30:43.519
For me, thankfully, it was pretty smooth.

00:30:43.519 --> 00:30:46.317
That's good, and I'll tell you why I think it was smooth.

00:30:46.317 --> 00:30:48.214
First of all, the grace of God.

00:30:48.214 --> 00:31:07.621
Second of all, I didn't play with her emotions and I talked to a lot of young brothers about that who are in situations where they might have a child that they had from a previous relationship and now you're with somebody else and you're wondering why it's so difficult.

00:31:07.621 --> 00:31:11.599
You know windows and tires and foolishness.

00:31:14.211 --> 00:31:19.417
You know, many times we kind of want our cake and eat it too, right, and you play with people's emotions like that.

00:31:19.417 --> 00:31:28.857
So when we decided that we wouldn't be together, we decided we weren't going to be together and I said I'm not going to be cruel to her.

00:31:28.857 --> 00:31:34.752
She has my son in her stomach and so I want to make sure she's straight.

00:31:34.752 --> 00:31:36.117
So she wants some grapes?

00:31:36.117 --> 00:31:38.395
Yeah, three in the morning I'm taking grapes.

00:31:38.395 --> 00:31:39.954
I'm like you know, I'm going to live with my boy.

00:31:39.954 --> 00:31:45.271
Okay, I didn't know better, I didn't know, but we had this understanding.

00:31:45.271 --> 00:31:46.571
Hey, we're not together, no more.

00:31:46.571 --> 00:31:47.633
But guess what?

00:31:47.633 --> 00:31:49.233
We got a son, wow.

00:31:49.233 --> 00:31:53.096
So we got to figure this thing, yeah, and we didn't bet 100.

00:31:53.996 --> 00:32:01.660
We ran into our challenges when you talked about the portion of the child in-house compared to your child that's not in the house.

00:32:01.660 --> 00:32:12.545
Even when it comes to correcting them as a parent, guilt can kick in and you allow the child outside of the house to get away with murder.

00:32:12.545 --> 00:32:13.945
Yeah, almost compared.

00:32:13.945 --> 00:32:17.948
And you're super hard on the ones who are right there and it's not fair.

00:32:17.948 --> 00:32:36.383
So I may have been a bit extra in the house at times and more lenient with my oldest, because I felt like he couldn't touch me when he wanted to, and so when we do have those opportunities for touches, the touches can't be me fussing.

00:32:36.383 --> 00:32:38.413
You get what I'm saying?

00:32:38.493 --> 00:32:40.319
I do Right, so yeah.

00:32:41.170 --> 00:32:42.012
So how do you?

00:32:42.012 --> 00:32:44.721
That's really hard to navigate.

00:32:45.111 --> 00:32:46.195
Very hard to navigate.

00:32:46.431 --> 00:32:47.529
I mean, it's really, really hard.

00:32:47.652 --> 00:32:48.769
I don't think there's an answer to it.

00:32:48.769 --> 00:32:51.490
I'm pretty sure somebody out there yeah somebody wrote a book.

00:32:51.490 --> 00:32:57.963
Yeah, but I don't know exactly how we navigated through that.

00:32:57.963 --> 00:33:00.875
I was learning as I go.

00:33:04.494 --> 00:33:09.564
So this may be and I want to get back to that relationship in just a second, but I just want to kind of pivot this way.

00:33:09.564 --> 00:33:16.604
If there's something here at this time you were a believer, you were in the church, right.

00:33:16.604 --> 00:33:34.813
Was there tension between you know your relationships in the church and your relationship with the relationships you had with kids and family and kind of you know your parenting living situation?

00:33:34.813 --> 00:33:36.702
I mean, maybe there wasn't your parenting living situation, was it?

00:33:36.702 --> 00:33:38.594
I mean maybe there wasn't.

00:33:38.614 --> 00:33:51.884
But I'm curious when you say the tension between so did you experience.

00:33:51.904 --> 00:34:06.952
You talked about guilt right, and you know was any of that guilt catalyzed by church at all or by other Christians, I would say no, yeah, I would say no, yeah, I would say no.

00:34:06.952 --> 00:34:13.985
I can say this, and the good thing is this is word to the wise for anybody who decided to do a podcast, and you may talk to your wife first.

00:34:13.985 --> 00:34:17.219
I talked to my wife in the parking lot.

00:34:17.219 --> 00:34:20.820
I said look, okay, I'm about to have a real conversation, right, you cool.

00:34:20.820 --> 00:34:31.005
But my wife I think if anybody would get on me, it would be her about putting everything first.

00:34:31.130 --> 00:34:33.777
And I didn't think I was.

00:34:33.777 --> 00:34:37.050
I didn't think I was like man, I'm doing the work of the Lord.

00:34:37.050 --> 00:34:38.393
You know what I'm saying.

00:34:38.393 --> 00:34:43.172
But I didn't realize that I'm working all day, and now I'm at the church.

00:34:43.172 --> 00:34:53.298
And if I'm not at the church, I'm at home working on church stuff, doing PowerPoints and putting together curriculums for Bible study and all of this, and I'm excited about it.

00:34:53.298 --> 00:34:56.804
And I'm thinking she's looking at me like, oh my God, he's doing the work of the Lord.

00:34:56.804 --> 00:35:15.443
But she's looking at me like, hey, spend some time with me and your kids, yeah, yeah, you know, I thought including my kids in that was exciting for them and they would get with it because I'm dead, but they need it.

00:35:15.443 --> 00:35:21.800
So I think that the tension would come from there, in-house, not from out-house.

00:35:21.800 --> 00:35:22.802
You're the hero.

00:35:23.804 --> 00:35:24.324
Yeah, that's real.

00:35:24.570 --> 00:35:39.018
Outside the house, right, yeah, and people don't—it takes a very mature person to recognize and say, hey, man, take care of home, we got this, take a break, take a sabbatical and go spend time with your kids.

00:35:39.018 --> 00:35:57.951
But me, coming from where I come from, man, I just had this zeal to live right, to serve God and I'm thinking, if I'm doing this, I'm happy, so everybody should be happy, right, you know?

00:35:57.951 --> 00:36:09.938
So it took me about I'll say it took me about my God 10 to 12 years of ministry before I realized I need to slow down.

00:36:09.938 --> 00:36:26.733
It took that long for me to say man, my kids are really growing up and I'm still dragging them along to do everything that I want to do and I need to invest a little bit more into who they are.

00:36:26.914 --> 00:36:35.222
So with your oldest son, yes, talk a little bit about that relationship.

00:36:35.222 --> 00:36:39.992
I know that has been it's, um, it's been a journey.

00:36:39.992 --> 00:36:42.940
Yeah, oh yeah what, what, what has that journey look like?

00:36:42.940 --> 00:36:57.786
And, um, what are some things that you have had to unlearn as a parent, particularly with your oldest son oh man, uh, eric, oh man, eric Jr, my boy, that's my boy, eric is now 24.

00:36:59.371 --> 00:37:13.623
And again, didn't know what I was doing in the beginning and I started to learn when I got 25, I'm telling you, somewhere in that window, 25 to 27, I was really on some more stuff.

00:37:13.623 --> 00:37:18.422
Like man, I'm trying to learn all I can so I can invest in my family and all that.

00:37:18.422 --> 00:37:34.329
But again, I'm learning about working now and you know I had neglected my education, so so many things stacked against me but I was so crazy in believing that, if God be for me, who could be against me?

00:37:34.329 --> 00:37:34.510
Right?

00:37:34.510 --> 00:37:36.878
So I'm just zealous and going.

00:37:37.550 --> 00:37:45.878
But as I learned and grew with Eric, I knew one thing he is going to be at my house.

00:37:45.878 --> 00:37:49.079
Now that's good and bad.

00:37:49.079 --> 00:37:49.663
Let me tell you why.

00:37:49.663 --> 00:37:53.896
Okay, it's good because I need to do that as a parent, I need to be in my son's life.

00:37:53.896 --> 00:38:00.503
But it was bad because I found out years later why I was doing it, the motive behind it.

00:38:01.050 --> 00:38:04.572
It was my own adverse childhood experiences, right as a kid.

00:38:04.572 --> 00:38:12.264
My dad's wife said no, he is not coming to this house.

00:38:12.264 --> 00:38:16.561
So I had in my mind nobody would never treat my son like that.

00:38:16.561 --> 00:38:19.936
So here I am, my crazy self.

00:38:19.936 --> 00:38:29.797
I have my son at the house because I want him with me, but at the same time, in my mind I'm trying to show my wife that my boy coming here.

00:38:29.797 --> 00:38:35.418
So I'm walking around with a magnifying glass watching her to see how she's going to treat my boy.

00:38:35.418 --> 00:38:37.829
So I'm walking around with a magnifying glass watching her to see how she's going to treat my boy, wow.

00:38:37.829 --> 00:38:50.385
So I say this humorously but if she were to give our biological son a green lollipop and give my son a red, my oldest son a red one, I'm like why are you giving him the red?

00:38:50.385 --> 00:38:51.166
Try to tell him to stop.

00:38:52.954 --> 00:38:55.280
We're just conjuring up foolishness.

00:38:55.280 --> 00:38:57.432
Wow, but I didn't know why.

00:38:57.432 --> 00:39:07.182
But it was my own adverse childhood experiences and I didn't want him to go through what I went through.

00:39:07.182 --> 00:39:09.057
And it was not even the case.

00:39:09.057 --> 00:39:17.221
She loved him, just like the rest of our kids, and she had to check me on that years later.

00:39:17.221 --> 00:39:19.677
Like you know, what are you doing?

00:39:19.677 --> 00:39:24.139
Yeah, you know, and I'm feeling like I had to protect him, but there's a flip side to that coin.

00:39:24.139 --> 00:39:29.440
She had the same thing with our daughter.

00:39:30.690 --> 00:39:38.264
She felt like she had to protect her because of her experiences as a child and her past relationship.

00:39:38.264 --> 00:39:43.356
Yeah, so they had this bond that you know.

00:39:43.356 --> 00:39:57.153
In reality, I know now that we, as parents, should have been on one accord right first, but she had this bond with our daughter, but I had the same thing.

00:39:57.153 --> 00:39:58.574
Yeah, my son, yeah.

00:39:58.635 --> 00:39:59.175
Right, that's right.

00:40:00.076 --> 00:40:11.083
And so we had to have to come to Jesus meeting to hey, this is not your daughter, this is not my son, these are our children, yeah, so we got to get on one on one course.

00:40:11.083 --> 00:40:16.226
So it took some hurdles and you know, along the way, but God did his thing.

00:40:16.226 --> 00:40:29.074
I'll say, for us, in our marriage, year number 12 or 13 was like the roughest ever.

00:40:29.074 --> 00:40:31.601
We hit a bump and it was because of the blended family.

00:40:31.601 --> 00:40:39.056
Wow, we hit a bump that we thought we couldn't overcome and it took a lot.

00:40:39.056 --> 00:40:54.485
It took some counseling, it took some tears, it took some real conversations, self-realization and all of the above for that to be totally restored to where we say, hey, nah, we're going to keep, we're strong together.

00:40:54.485 --> 00:40:55.489
Right, you know what I'm saying.

00:40:55.489 --> 00:40:58.295
So now fast forward.

00:40:58.295 --> 00:41:02.364
My oldest and I, we hit a bump in the road.

00:41:02.364 --> 00:41:07.722
Today is actually the one-year anniversary of his brother's murder.

00:41:07.722 --> 00:41:10.157
His brother was killed.

00:41:10.157 --> 00:41:13.597
Wow, everybody knew about the young doll situation.

00:41:13.597 --> 00:41:22.541
Right around that time his brother was killed, and it had nothing to do with that, but he was killed around that time.

00:41:22.541 --> 00:41:28.021
And so this is the one-year anniversary today of his brother's death.

00:41:28.110 --> 00:41:35.994
But my son went through a real tough period prior to that and I think about it.

00:41:35.994 --> 00:41:36.898
I did the same thing.

00:41:36.898 --> 00:41:51.179
As much as I admired and respected my father, I had some things that I felt like he didn't quite get right according to my standards and I cut him off for some years.

00:41:51.179 --> 00:41:57.653
No reason, he's trying to reach out to me, I just cut him off and I was gone in the streets doing my thing.

00:41:57.653 --> 00:42:05.514
So my son had his stint and he did the same thing and it took the Lord because I was so upset, and it took the Lord to show me like hey, you did the same thing.

00:42:05.514 --> 00:42:09.655
So he had this moment where he kind of bagged off for a while.

00:42:09.655 --> 00:42:11.789
Then he lost his brother in the process.

00:42:11.789 --> 00:42:14.972
But through that God restored our relationship.

00:42:14.972 --> 00:42:17.172
So he and I are back.

00:42:17.172 --> 00:42:30.498
You know, like we never left right and but you said something a few minutes ago about some things that I wish I could go back and do different and learn.

00:42:30.498 --> 00:42:33.079
I learned with my oldest son.

00:42:36.079 --> 00:42:49.965
We had a conversation during that process of reconciling our relationship and I thought I just knew why he did what he did and I was thinking in my head I'm like he and his feelings, you know.

00:42:49.965 --> 00:42:52.206
But he shared with me.

00:42:52.206 --> 00:42:59.369
He said, wasn't the fact that you how did he word it?

00:42:59.369 --> 00:43:08.710
He said it was not the fact that you didn't agree with me.

00:43:08.710 --> 00:43:12.954
He said I didn't expect you to agree with the choice that he was about to make.

00:43:12.954 --> 00:43:15.454
He said but I did expect you to come get me.

00:43:15.454 --> 00:43:28.581
And when he said that to me, it's like it cut me Because I was like man, I was so bent on being right, but the situation was still wrong.

00:43:29.021 --> 00:43:29.463
Make sense.

00:43:29.463 --> 00:43:52.057
So for me, if I could go back, I would say man, it's not about who right and who wrong, because if you win the battle but you lose the war, I was 45 at that time.

00:43:52.057 --> 00:44:05.672
At 45, I had to apologize to my son for not being there for him the way he needed me, not the way you know.

00:44:05.672 --> 00:44:06.494
I thought I knew what he needed.

00:44:06.494 --> 00:44:09.260
Again, that comes from you being the adult thinking you know everything.

00:44:13.434 --> 00:44:33.110
So I would have listened more, eric.

00:44:33.110 --> 00:44:35.353
You're saying so much and I'm trying to.

00:44:35.353 --> 00:44:58.349
Honestly, I'm sitting here, just I am just sitting here listening at this story and just your journey, and I know a lot of people have experienced probably parts of what you're talking about for sure, from just blended family coming into a marriage, coming into a relationship with kids, having to parent kids in the home, out of the home.

00:44:58.530 --> 00:44:58.670
Yeah.

00:44:58.929 --> 00:45:17.050
You know tension around you, know your marriage relationship after being there for a while and that still being there, like you know, parenting an adult child, particularly one who does have a little bit of a chip on his shoulder.

00:45:17.050 --> 00:45:23.423
But in all of that you, and almost every story you've told you, have traced it back.

00:45:23.423 --> 00:45:24.612
You've traced you.

00:45:24.612 --> 00:45:26.175
You know what I'm saying.

00:45:26.175 --> 00:45:30.490
You have seen you, you've identified you in the scenario.

00:45:30.490 --> 00:45:45.907
I want to know what work have you done to get to the place where you're willing to see yourself in life, some of the things that you've seen in your children?

00:45:48.735 --> 00:46:06.704
I tell you what a lot of listening to other people who have been here before, Some of my mentors in their 60s maybe and they're like man, you know, I went through this and talking to them about it.

00:46:06.704 --> 00:46:23.907
Also, more than anything, it's just man using the word of God as a mirror, you know, and not really looking in it to see other people, but to see myself, and just a continuous improvement, looking for ways to continue to get better.

00:46:23.907 --> 00:46:27.141
And you know, hey, I'm going to have grandkids one day, right?

00:46:27.141 --> 00:46:28.755
Yeah, yeah, you know.

00:46:28.755 --> 00:46:35.603
So I want to be able to give my children advice, to say hey here's some places where I may have messed up.

00:46:37.295 --> 00:46:44.869
So I think there's no magic wand to it or particular strategy I use or anything.

00:46:44.869 --> 00:47:02.184
It's just man, I'm just trying to improve day by day, get better listening, and you know, when you see your children go through things in life and you can't just look at them and say I told them you should have you got.

00:47:02.184 --> 00:47:08.246
To look at you, say what could I have done different early on to prevent this from happening?

00:47:08.246 --> 00:47:10.541
Right, they make their own choices and decisions.

00:47:10.541 --> 00:47:11.143
They do stuff.

00:47:11.143 --> 00:47:18.708
But I think a lot of times when we look at ourselves we'll see the root cause of it is again how we handle them.

00:47:18.708 --> 00:47:19.650
Right, right.

00:47:23.141 --> 00:47:26.907
And how your hurts have impacted your actions Absolutely.

00:47:27.509 --> 00:47:52.724
And and I think that's so, you know, we you know, being an adult child, having conversations with my parents as an adult is very different, and we talk all the time like we'll we'll share me and my siblings will share experiences we had growing up that we didn't say as as kids, but and then we'll say it and they'll be like, oh my gosh, I had no idea.

00:47:52.724 --> 00:47:58.577
And then sometimes begin to beat themselves up because it's like I should have known, I should have done something.

00:47:58.577 --> 00:47:59.360
I hate that.

00:47:59.360 --> 00:48:09.501
That was the case, that was not what we thought, or not what we expected, or whatever.

00:48:09.501 --> 00:48:13.750
You know what I'm saying and it's like no, no, no, no, no, it's.

00:48:13.750 --> 00:48:15.219
There wasn't anything you could do.

00:48:15.219 --> 00:48:18.242
There's nothing you could have done.

00:48:19.695 --> 00:48:20.820
Some things like you were saying.

00:48:20.820 --> 00:48:37.985
It's good for kids to go through, right, but what I think has been interesting and is seeing is watching my parents see them in us and like and having that, oh, like.

00:48:37.985 --> 00:48:39.985
This is why this bothers me so much.

00:48:39.985 --> 00:48:49.170
Oh, this is what, and that is not an easy thing to come to as a parent, as an older age.

00:48:49.170 --> 00:48:51.072
You know what I mean.

00:48:51.072 --> 00:49:22.431
You're still learning you today and I think it takes a level of humility to be willing to do that and be willing to continue to grow and learn and shift and change and unlearn, even yourself, even the parts of yourself that other people probably prop up and really respect and admire, like you were saying about Superdad, right?

00:49:22.431 --> 00:49:23.014
You know what I'm saying?

00:49:23.014 --> 00:49:24.780
Hey, that's a badge of honor.

00:49:24.780 --> 00:49:26.266
The minivan, yeah, Right, for real, all these kids.

00:49:26.327 --> 00:49:27.170
Like hey, that's a badge of honor.

00:49:27.190 --> 00:49:27.452
The minivan.

00:49:27.472 --> 00:49:47.911
Yeah, right, like for real, all these kids at my house, right, they love coming over here, but your kids, you know and you were able to see, like, okay, maybe I needed to modify my actions a little bit for that, even though other people gave me the badge, gave me the medal, for things like that.

00:49:49.034 --> 00:49:59.797
I was talking to my brother on the way here and I told him about the podcast and asked him I said, man, what are some things that you wish you had did different?

00:49:59.818 --> 00:50:12.387
He said probably that militant type style of leadership I had in the home.

00:50:12.387 --> 00:50:18.833
He said it was kind of like for me everything had to be planned out and had to go exactly like this.

00:50:18.833 --> 00:50:30.621
He's a military guy and he said I probably would be a bit more understanding and listen a bit more and give them room to experience life and make mistakes.

00:50:30.621 --> 00:50:31.583
Yeah, instead of.

00:50:31.583 --> 00:50:35.041
And I told her and that's when I said, man, we just got this thing in us.

00:50:35.041 --> 00:50:37.302
We feel like we have to protect them.

00:50:37.302 --> 00:51:04.483
You know, and and and I think poverty breathes that sometimes, like coming from where we came from, from nothing, and seeing the things that we've seen, you just feel like you have to and I just felt like I may have muzzled them a bit as kids and by me not being exposed to a ton of things.

00:51:04.483 --> 00:51:08.148
It limited what I could expose them to you get what I'm saying.

00:51:08.188 --> 00:51:08.708
Yeah, for sure.

00:51:09.610 --> 00:51:10.090
So yeah.

00:51:10.391 --> 00:51:23.057
Yeah, so I think it's interesting having this conversation about parenting and blending families, because you know a lot of people.

00:51:23.057 --> 00:51:35.391
I don't know the exact statistics on it, but a lot of people are getting married older, which means that a lot of people are probably entering into some version of a blended family.

00:51:36.534 --> 00:51:44.114
And that's a lot more common today than it probably was 20, 30, 40 years ago.

00:51:44.114 --> 00:51:50.260
Right, you know 20, 30, 40 years ago, in that you know what and you've said a lot.

00:51:50.260 --> 00:51:59.148
But like, what are some things in when you are dating people that have children?

00:51:59.148 --> 00:52:03.652
You know, and are, or in, you know, exploring a relationship with people that have children?

00:52:03.652 --> 00:52:07.557
What's some of the things that you can say?

00:52:07.557 --> 00:52:12.528
Hey, it's important to have these types of conversations.

00:52:12.528 --> 00:52:17.155
What should you consider when it comes to a life as a blended family?

00:52:17.635 --> 00:52:27.769
I think the first piece of advice I would give whether it be the man or the woman don't force it.

00:52:27.769 --> 00:52:35.588
Don't force it Because think about a child who is away from one of their parents.

00:52:35.588 --> 00:52:57.427
So, no matter how bad it was or what happened when that child is still young, and even as they grow up in 10 years, sometime in adulthood, they still have this vision of the picket fence and the poodle and mom and dad being together, Right, and there's that inkling of hope there saying they're going to get back together.

00:52:57.427 --> 00:53:06.998
Yeah, it's temporary, right here, yeah, and so that child and this is not from me, this is from Gary Chapman child's, and this is not from me, this is from Gary Chapman.

00:53:07.097 --> 00:53:20.190
I was listening to a podcast with him and another gentleman he wrote a book with and he talked about how that child's love language could be physical touch.

00:53:20.190 --> 00:53:31.228
But they don't want your touch and you're trying to force it because you think you've read all these books and all this stuff and oh, so I'm going to keep hugging them.

00:53:31.228 --> 00:53:33.222
They don't want to hug from you right now.

00:53:33.222 --> 00:53:36.184
Let that kind of be organic and come natural.

00:53:36.184 --> 00:53:38.181
You just might need to do a fist bump.

00:53:38.181 --> 00:53:42.103
Yeah, until that child initiates, that's good.

00:53:42.123 --> 00:53:47.436
That hug right and I was like that's wisdom, yeah, that's wisdom, that's wisdom.

00:53:47.436 --> 00:53:47.820
That hug right.

00:53:47.820 --> 00:53:50.155
And I was like that's wisdom, yeah, that's wisdom, that's wisdom instead of forcing it.

00:53:50.155 --> 00:54:02.590
And me personally, I'll say this my daughter, who's not my biological daughter, she had a biological dad in her life and I mean took care of her.

00:54:02.590 --> 00:54:03.550
He took care of her.

00:54:03.550 --> 00:54:11.715
He and I didn't see eye to eye, but he took care of his daughter.

00:54:11.715 --> 00:54:16.885
And so one thing this is another piece of advice I'll give One thing I think I got right.

00:54:16.885 --> 00:54:20.114
I can say I got this right.

00:54:21.215 --> 00:54:26.291
I would not allow her and that's a strong word, allow but I wouldn't allow her to talk negatively about her biological father.

00:54:26.291 --> 00:54:26.871
That's good, yeah.

00:54:26.871 --> 00:54:34.869
And parents have to watch that, because children know how to be manipulative as well to get their way.

00:54:34.869 --> 00:54:38.965
The Bible said foolishness is bound up in the heart of a child.

00:54:38.965 --> 00:54:43.487
So they know how to be manipulative to get their way.

00:54:43.487 --> 00:54:46.786
So she would be gone with her father.

00:54:46.786 --> 00:54:49.463
But if she come home, he made her upset.

00:54:49.463 --> 00:54:51.782
I wouldn't entertain that.

00:54:51.782 --> 00:54:55.483
I cut that off immediately.

00:54:55.483 --> 00:54:57.556
No, we're not doing that Now.

00:54:57.556 --> 00:55:02.568
I can't control what happened with her by a lot of your fault.

00:55:02.568 --> 00:55:08.507
I can't control anything that he may have said or anything or didn't say, but I can control what I do.

00:55:08.507 --> 00:55:13.193
I'm not going to do that because I want you to respect your father.

00:55:13.213 --> 00:55:31.172
Yeah, you're just upset right now because you didn't get what you wanted and some parents fall some of the bonus dads or bonus moms, or even the biological they again, it's all about experiences.

00:55:31.172 --> 00:55:42.480
They can be bitter at the other individual so they will allow the child to talk bad about that other individual because you don't like them either and now you don't want your child.

00:55:42.480 --> 00:55:47.628
So you're trying to live through your child, your experiences, and that's a toxic situation.

00:55:47.628 --> 00:55:52.253
So I think that you should still teach them to honor their other parent.

00:55:52.253 --> 00:55:58.268
Yeah, and don't try to make, don't like, don't make your kids call you dad.

00:55:58.268 --> 00:55:59.840
That should be natural.

00:55:59.840 --> 00:56:01.300
Yeah, I want to earn it.

00:56:02.336 --> 00:56:03.059
You know what I'm saying?

00:56:03.059 --> 00:56:09.001
Just love them where they are, get to know them, let them process it.

00:56:09.001 --> 00:56:11.463
Don't try to force something that don't fit.

00:56:11.463 --> 00:56:18.085
That's one thing I would say, and have that clear communication.

00:56:18.085 --> 00:56:23.485
I would give the same advice I give to younger couples who are married.

00:56:23.485 --> 00:56:23.905
It's funny.

00:56:23.905 --> 00:56:24.507
I say that now.

00:56:24.507 --> 00:56:27.731
I'm like I've been married 20 years, but I bet somebody married 50 years.

00:56:27.731 --> 00:56:28.275
Like you're a rookie.

00:56:28.275 --> 00:56:31.159
But what I say to my rookies.

00:56:31.159 --> 00:56:34.487
I say, man, what do you say?

00:56:34.487 --> 00:56:40.606
The, I guess, key ingredients are for a marriage to be successful?

00:56:40.606 --> 00:56:50.974
I tell them three things, man keep God first, have clear communication and keep folks at your business, especially your family.

00:56:50.994 --> 00:56:51.114
Yeah.

00:56:51.695 --> 00:56:55.045
Like you know and I think you do the same thing with your kids.

00:56:55.755 --> 00:56:56.762
Yeah, that's real.

00:56:57.003 --> 00:56:58.976
You know what I'm saying, god.

00:56:58.976 --> 00:57:12.427
First listen to them more than you talk, because we think we know everything because we are adults, but we don't know how they're processing their experience better than them.

00:57:12.427 --> 00:57:14.963
I don't care how grown you are, I mean the books you've read.

00:57:14.963 --> 00:57:21.144
So, clear communication with them and keep focused.

00:57:21.144 --> 00:57:23.422
You know what I'm saying.

00:57:23.422 --> 00:57:31.885
Like, spend time listening and talking to them, and when they share something with you, that's between y'all.

00:57:31.885 --> 00:57:32.757
You know.

00:57:32.757 --> 00:57:34.202
So that would be my advice.

00:57:37.056 --> 00:57:40.326
Eric, this has been incredibly rich.

00:57:41.277 --> 00:57:42.702
You brought me out, you brought me out.

00:57:42.702 --> 00:57:44.541
I don't do podcasts.

00:57:47.318 --> 00:57:47.458
Y'all.

00:57:47.458 --> 00:57:48.282
This has been a treat.

00:57:48.282 --> 00:57:48.943
He really doesn't.

00:57:48.943 --> 00:57:49.806
He's being for real.

00:57:49.806 --> 00:57:50.992
He doesn't do stuff like me.

00:57:50.992 --> 00:58:02.864
He does not typically do stuff like this and especially Cher, and I appreciate your vulnerability and your transparency Absolutely and I really think this is going to help a lot of people.

00:58:02.884 --> 00:58:03.244
I hope so.

00:58:03.494 --> 00:58:09.248
Like I really do, because it's such a tricky thing.

00:58:09.248 --> 00:58:12.425
And it's a tricky thing.

00:58:12.425 --> 00:58:36.025
Relationships are tricky anyway, but bringing in children and then by them other adults is tricky, and to navigate that well and then to have the humility to be willing to continue to learn is such a quality I think a lot of people, I hope a lot of people can really gain from.

00:58:36.025 --> 00:58:39.422
So thank you for sharing.

00:58:39.724 --> 00:58:40.224
Thanks for having me.

00:58:40.585 --> 00:58:41.088
Absolutely.

00:58:41.088 --> 00:58:42.335
This was so good.

00:58:42.335 --> 00:58:50.226
All right, thank you once again for listening to the Unlearned Podcast.

00:58:50.226 --> 00:58:54.391
We would love to hear your comments and your feedback about the episode.

00:58:54.391 --> 00:59:03.619
Feel free to follow us on Facebook and Instagram and to let us know what you think.

00:59:03.619 --> 00:59:07.487
We're looking forward to the next time when we are able to unlearn together to move forward towards freedom.

00:59:07.487 --> 00:59:08.409
See you then.